How Can I Get Subutex Not Suboxone? (Page 3)
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I don't know how to go about this as I am shaking and can barely focus, I need help! Please. I fear that my life is going to end from my abuse of opiates. I am currently taking 250 mgs of oxycontin per day. I have a loving fiance and a stepdaughter that I want to be here for. I sit here with cold sweats, and fear going out just because I may make the fearful turn to the meds. Any and all info on how to obtain Subutex would be much appreciated. This wasn't what I wanted my life to be, and I can not let it end this way..Please help me. I am not a religious man but I pray for help as I am at my wits end with this drug.

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Hi kkh, this is dani. I think we have chatted before on here...Sorry if I just don't remember your particulars, but I am wondering how long altogether, between your short time on suboxone and then taking subutex, were you on bupe altogether? How did you make the switch from subutex to methadone? Did you have nasty side effects with the subutex, as well? I have posed the question on here a few times now & haven't gotten an answer to date, asking in what is the difference between suboxone & subutex, to be hopefully answered by someone with a history similar to mine, in that I have only ever had suboxone (in both pill & film form), and have never had heroin or methadone. I started taking suboxone october 2010 for opiate addiction, and for me that was just your standard myriad of percocet, vicodin, oxycodone, oxycontin, & any other med in that arena. I have not had a relapse at all since taking suboxone, as prescribed all this time, never got it by any shady means & even had the same doc my first 5 years on it, but just the same, even though it's helped, I find more & more I just have too many days where I am getting nasty headaches & have a nauseous stomach. Sometimes chewing on a tums or alka seltzer chewable takes the edge off of the nausea. I have always loved eating & been a pretty fit gal, but my appetite has gone to hell in a hand basket the last 3 years or so, where eating is just more of a necessity then something to be enjoyed, ya know? Also, isn't methadone a full agonist opioid, though perhaps not one of the stronger and more addictive ones? I don't want to come off ignorant in any way and have lots of reading over the years but come across conflicting info at best. For whatever reasons, it seems since suboxone was fda approved, methadone was no longer the drug of choice for opiate addiction, though I guess it is still the main "Go to drug" for heroin addiction - is this correct? Or maybe is it that you are a chronic pain sufferer & this is why you take methadone now? Just curious. Always trying to remain open to other therapies, especially since more & more I am not as comfortable with suboxone as I used to be. Maybe this is because I can no longer take the tablet & only get the film, not sure.

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THEKINGPIN: When I started Bupe in 2009, I didn't know anything about this drug. I didn't know there was a difference between the two, etc. I was already a migraine sufferer at the time. I was on the Suboxone for about a week-10 days, and had a migraine almost every day while on it. (at the time, I was getting migraines about once a week, so this was unusal) I also had extreme, chronic nausea while on the Suboxone. I was miserable to the point of not even being able to work. The doctor wanted to see me back in his office to see how I was doing and I told him I was having all these problems. He switched me immediately to Subutex, and within a day or two, the migraines and nausea went away. So when I saw him the next month to get my refill, he noted in my file that I had a "extreme sensitivity/allergy" to the Naloxone.

As far as how much the Suboxone cost, I don't remember since it has been almost 7 years ago, and I was only on it for a week or so. I do remember that it was a little more than the Subutex, but I have United insurance, so my co-pay for a month's worth of Subutex was only about 30 bucks. I am fortunate that my spouse has good insurance, as I am a part time research assistant, part time fly fishing guide, and as you may know, part time usually equals "no insurance". As far as the pharmacy, I remember that when I first switched over, it took them a day to get a supply of the Subutex, since all they had was Suboxone. After that, it was never a problem. Since they had to "order" the Subutex, I have a feeling I was the only customer at that particular Walgreens who was on Subutex, and they kept some in stock for me.

That doctor has since retired from seeing patients (I actually work with him now though) and my current doctor also noted in my file that I have a Naloxone allergy. I am currently on tablet Methadone instead of Subutex, and am titrating down slowly, having gone from a starting dose of 90 mgs, down to 70mgs. Will be going down to 65 mgs in the next week or so. Methadone just works better for me, Subs work better for others. Let me know if you have any more questions.

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Kkh

How long did it take you to finally get them to actually believe it was a true allergy? Did you have a hard time finding a pharmacy to fill it for you? Was the cost for this a consideration for you? You seem to be very knowledgable in this protocol

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Ekidrocks,
Very well stated,I can't take exception to anything you shared regarding the validity of rx ing subutex as opposed to suboxone.I differ in the suggestion to seek a new prescriber since realistically speaking access to specialized professionals,Financial considerations and availability of pharmacies willing to fill them creates a true DILEMA for the patient being treated with suboxone . I'm pleased you found an alternative and wish everyone could, AS IT SHOULD BE.
Regards....

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EKIDROCKS: When I started on Bupe, I started on Suboxone, not Subutex. My migraines increased and I was nauseous 24-7. After a week, I was switched to Subutex, and the horrible side effects went away. Turns out I am allergic to the Naloxone in the Subutex. So there can most definitely be bad side effects from a very small amount of Naloxone (it has less than 10% bioavailability when taken sublingually). But those things have nothing to do with the intended effects of the Naloxone on the addicted brain. People think that the Naloxone is the "blocker" in Suboxone, but it was only put into Bupe to keep people from taking it intravenously, where the bioavailability is 100%.

Anyone who is needing Subutex instead of Suboxone because of having a bad reaction to Naloxone needs to get documentation from their physician or an ER doctor stating what is going on. My records state that I am allergic to Naloxone.

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To anyone who has questions regarding subutex vs. suboxone, I can tell you what I went through and the drastic difference between the two medications. A lot of doctors will tell you that the naloxone component to suboxone has little to no side effects and "most people" do not notice a difference. When I was on suboxone, I told my doctor that it made me depressed as hell, I mean damn near suicidal, and he would try to justify keeping me on it. I began my research on the Internet, and of course, there were hundreds and hundreds of people saying the exact same thing. Armed with this information, I went to my next appointment and showed my doctor what I had printed out on the topic. He finally agreed to give me a trial of buprenorphine 8mg 3 times daily, and within 24 hrs I was a new man. My depression was gone, my stomach no longer felt chronically empty, it was life-changing for me! DO NOT LET YOUR DOCTOR TELL YOU THAT NALOXONE HAS VERY FEW SIDE EFFECTS OR THAT YOU HAVE TO STAY ON SUBOXONE, IT'S ABSOLUTELY UNTRUE, IT'S WELL DOCUMENTED, AND YOU DON'T HAVE TO SUFFER! IF YOUR CURRENT DOCTOR IS UNWILLING TO SWITCH YOU TO SUBUTEX/BUPRENORPHINE, FIND ANOTHER DOCTOR!

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I think it is absolutely necessary to take, and manage my own inventory not everyone else's. Its so important (for myself) that I dont look outside the box otherwise I will set myself to fail. These drugs are mind altering and very tricky. For me I follow all the suggestions that apply to recovery not failure. I fought, bounced around did all I could to micro manage this medication when the anwser is on the outside of the bottle. All I needed was to follow the instructions, and I'll be damned its been 3years plus plus and I have not picked up. So for that I am so very thankful. Please hang in there all it will work for you as well. : )

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MALEAKE: Not sure where WHO got WHAT from? Unfortunately when you hit "REPLY" on here, it just posts the comment on the forum in general, not to anyone specific.

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Its the same thing so not sure where u got that from just saying

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BOBBY: If you are talking about the "highs" from Suboxone/Subutex...I hear ya. Any legit opioid addict with an ACTUAL habit won't feel high from Subutex. And all these people trying to figure out how to keep using their drug of choice while on Subutex/Suboxone....why are you even ON this stuff? Do it right or don't waste my time.

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I read a lot of you talking about getting high I don't know yet what y'all mean.i have yet to feel any out of normal except it does take most of the pain away.But I sure know what withdrawals feel like thought I was going to get surgery and stoped boy that was a wake up call for me but I just don't understand the highs

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JAC: It is best to be on 40mgs of Methadone or less before switching to Suboxone. Methadone takes for frigging EVER to get completely out of your system, and the higher the dose, the higher it takes. I have seen someone go through Precipitated Withdrawals after waiting SIX DAYS after Methadone, because they were on 75 milligrams of the Meth. Six days. Some doctors won't even ATTEMPT to switch you if you are on more than 30 or 40 milligrams of Meth.

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hi kkh, thanks for your 11/21 message, a definite LOL on appropriate "bs" username remark, and finally, yes agreed on that people mostly do NOT suck, lmao...soooo not like me to spout off like that & major reinforcement on my "just read but do not post comments" policy when i am in a completely sideways state of mind and/or in suboxone withdrawal due to error & incompetency on behalf of the 'establishment'....dani

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DANI: I understand what you are going through. People like this BS person? (What an appropriate user name!) Just blow them off. And no, people do not "mostly suck", it just seems that way when you are going through something so frustrating. Hang in there and stay strong.

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Um, wooooah, hold on there....if I don't care about my recovery? I said nothing to imply any such thing. jesus, i should not have vented online while being forced into withdrawal, i left myself open to an idiotic remark, no offense. I mean, I am a 46 year old intelligent classy woman, I do not need to be told to grow some "whatever" - and i don't think you read my volume carefully - I did everything an intelligent person in recovery over 10 years could & would have done in my situation - YOU try fighting the powers that be when dealing with horrible, necessary evil medicaid. Maybe I am not taking you right, but I have been dealing with massive amounts of BS, incompetence, rude ignorant a-hole people in the health insurance & medical community, and I have hit my limit and sick of being nicer to people then they deserve when all I get in return is s*** on -- People for the most part SUCK and are stupid. I am a good, fun, loving, caring person and would be simply blown away to get even one comment or remark from a person who understands where i am coming from & feels my pain. I would actually feel hope for the first time in months, instead of this sickeningly despairing frustration i am choking on.

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DANI926, That's really Pathetic!!!! Why don't you grow a set of whatever and fight FOR YOUR RIGHTS, ITS YOUR LIFE. If you don't care enough about your recovery (some TOOTHLESS WIG WEARING PIG OF A STAFF MEMBER as you openly describe her SURE WILL NOT!!!!). No one on this planet is more important then YOU!!!! PLEASE HELP YOURSELF AND YOUR LOVED ONES BY FIGHTING. WE ALL DESERVE THE RIGHT TO LIVE A SOBER AND DRUG FREE LIFE. God speed.....

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You were on 16th a day of methadone did you have to reduce to go on subutex if so how much?

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Wow!!! So sorry that you are going through such bulls***! Try and keep your head held high! Keep on keeping on...I really wish you luck in this nightmare that is our health system!

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thanks, James, i appreciate your saying so....i have the unfortunate perfect case-in-point this very uncomfortable sunday night of Mischief, 10/30, as i am starting to go into withdrawal from not getting my suboxone due to the ongoing bulls*** games i play with both my doctors office, as well as blue cross blue shield of de...i love my suboxone doctor, but let's be honest, a doctor is as good as his or her office staff, and this office is straight out of HELL as they are so insanely incompetent and after having 6 years of success on suboxone this past 9/30, in the last 2 months i have been forced into precipitated withdrawals 3 or 4 times now. it's been a real nightmare and just when i have battled through all of the crap and think i got all of the bases covered, they up the game. unfortunately, i have had to temporarily go on medicaid in delaware the last 9 months. when i was on suboxone the first 5 years, i had private AETNA insurance thru my employer. thank GOD i was able to have it that way for 5 years!! 5 solid years of total success, no relapsing back on full opiates and never even thought about it, totally returned to having a normal and mostly rewarding life and took sub as prescribed. i am not ashamed to say at this time, even after 6 years, if i remain on it longer and/or indefinitely, so what I don't care and people who have an issue with that haven't walked in my shoes, so if it ain't broke, don't fix it, right? Yeah well tell government paid health care that!!! they want to continually go on & on & on about the huge crisis and epidemic of opiate-related addictions and overdoses, accidental or otherwise, yet i know i am not the only good person out there who is using the necessary evil of medicaid right now, and why not? i paid into it all of my adult tax paying life, so now here it is for me when i really need it, only i am getting the feeling they WANT ME TO SCREW UP because they do NOT like having to pay for these expensive suboxone films. they are total a**holes and i took the pills for 5 years and never liked the film, and i even adjusted to the generic pill, which is cheaper of course, but NO, they don't like the tablet because they say it is easier for the F*** UPS who abuse this system, to give them to each other and sell and cash & carry them around, which is just completely INSANE to me. i mean come on, it's this very small thin foil packet barely thicker than paper, do they really think the films aren't being sold on the streets as well as the tabs? no, what it REALLY is, is that they are getting the expensive brand name film for FREE from the drug manufacturer, which is why it is the only kind we are allowed to get. I never went through withdrawal from sub during my first 5 years and i never ran out. in my 6th year of suboxone, quite honestly, i don't know how I have made it this far, other then for the fact to go in any other direction clearly is not an option for me at this stage in the game. sorry, i am venting. just very upset & frustrated and feel like doing harm to the evil entity i have to go thru to keep my sobriety.

I only had insurance pay for my prescription the 1st five years - I DID have to pay for the monthly doc visit, yes, he was a greedy guy, but i still liked him enough to pay him lots of money from 2010-2015 and it was worth it because i had a good job and thought nothing of the money after a while because it was so much better then the pathetic way I was living prior to this!
Ok so Medicaid has no idea of my 5 years before them and that i was a shining example of what a suboxone patient is supposed to be, so i get treated like a junkie 3 days out of free rehab and every appt i have to give them urin, which i will never get used to. my other doctor asked me for urin maybe 2 or 3 times in 5 years. he knew i was working a program. so i gave urin on 9/21 and health insurance decided on 10/27 that it wasn't RECENT ENOUGH URIN??? so i go in friday 10/28 and piss in the cup and now i do what? wait for the results? how long does this take? does anybody know? i have asked anybody i can ask in my line of fire, and either they are incompetent *****s working at my doctors office, which of course they really are, or they bounce me back to "THE OTHER GUY". i love my new suboxone doctor, she is a wonderful lady and i truly like her, but the reality is is that she is only as good as her staff, and her staff is HORRIBLE and they don't give a s*** that I have been forced into withdrawal 3 different times now since AUGUST due to their lazy, half assed, slow, incorrectly filled out paperwork and pre authorizations to be faxed, or sending things too late in day, or flat out forgetting and lying to me that they did, as if i cant found out. and what is even more upsetting is that i am a sissy with stuff like this, even when i know i am right and within reason to feel as i do, i will have to call doctors office tomorrow to inquire about this whole u/a process, as i have a majorly vested interest in it seeing as i am in withdrawal and feel like DEATH BREAD. the office b**** is mean to me and talks to me like garbage and resents that i am trying to make her do her freakin job. lazy lazy lazy and unbelievable unprofessional. she is missing her front teeth and wears fake hair that is beyond obvious and looks awful, and she answers the phone of a doctors office as though she has just rolled out of bed. but this is what i am stuck with because so many docs around here aren't taking new patients. what does one have to do to get one of the good doctors? or at least, good office staff? i have to be careful of what i tell my doctor, because if i complain about her awful help from circus hell, they will be even meaner to me and probably start tainting my urin samples. i just would like to know, when one has provided a sample on a friday and are told the samples get picked up every day, then what happens? is it possible that my urin will be evaluated monday and i can get my suboxone monday if its early enough? oh no, i have to wait for the pre auth to be faxed by the toothless office pig who doesnt like to be told she has to do things for patients in order for them to not keep going in withdrawal. i can't wait to find a new doctor, God willing, and look forward to the day i get to finally post a real legitimate review on their website. i am going to destroy this woman as she is now destroying me with her negligence.

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JOEY: Go on Suboxone.com, put in your city or your zip code, and a list of doctors will come up in your area. I am assuming you need to find a doctor for Opioid Replacement Therapy, in other words, Suboxone.

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