Taking Subutex And Percocet Together (Page 23)

My doctor just put me on subutex along with percocet. I've been on percocet for yrs for severe and chronic migraines. He told me to take the subutex and if it doesn't work to take a percocet. I usually take 15 mg percocet at a time. I've read some stuff online that worries me. Some people say if you take percs with subutex you'll go into withdrawals. I went through severe withdrawals with fioricet months ago and I don't want to go through that hell again. I took my first subutex about an hour ago and I still have a migraine so I want to take a perc now. Can I do that or will I get sick?

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The only way you go into withdrawal is if you take a Suboxone then take a pain pill. Subutex has no naloxone so you're good.

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You went through fioricet withdrawal? And it was ruff?....Damn how long were u on it?...Your talking about the pills with a slight barbituate in it and slight caffeine in it right? Usually comes in the pills with the imprint of the persons face/head with like a pounding headache look to it?...Wow....My x use to give those to me they never did a thing..Very weak..They dont make those ruff strong barbituates anymore that were screwing people up like tumanol and seconal....My brother in law who was a lot older then me told me about those things lol..He was an opiate addict at a time so he knew about drugs..He said the were pretty hardcore but they took them off the market years ago..Just like they took qualudes of the market years ago. In the 70's they were called the love drug...And they were prescribed but they became too popular for their own good and they pulled those off the market..They werent a barbituate but kinda in their own class..Only place they have them now is in south africa..Where back door chemists make queludes themselves lol.....Ohh but dont worry too much about the subutex ...Im on it....Too..Just dont ever ever mix it with methadone or u will have the worst withdrawal known..And naloxone in suboxone really has nothing to do with blocking lol..Its just a lil additive I believe recckitt benkster the pharm company added to regular buprenorphine which is subutex and has been patented in the 50's and used in the mid to late 80's I.M. As in the muscle by needle for opiate addicts because buprenorphine in itself is the real opioid/opiate blocker...Naloxone was added to the other companies as a cash cow full of lies..Lol..Buprenorphone/subutex itself is the blocker and will make u sick if u mess around the wrong way big time just like suboxone....And bupe aka subutex fills the 3 main mu opioid receptors and with about a few days or a week hit the "Ceiling effect" meaning any opiate u take will bounce off no matter how much...Including if u take 1 or 10 subutex u wont feel a thing..Might od or feel sick but thats it...Difference is suboxone is a garbage cash cow and u are not suppose to take naloxone every day it is like toxic on the body..First they found that it ****s the kidneys up..The suboxone from the naloxone..Now they say it ****s the liver up, and why do u think they take a woman off of suboxone and put her on regular buprenorphine aka subutex when prego or nursing.. Cuz its bad for the fetus, the baby...The naloxone in the suboxone...Cash cow doctor kick backs reckit benkster or whoever makes suboxone are in with the dea and feds lying and even giving them kick backs I think in some areas from what I have seen...Cuz most sub doctors do not want to write u subutex....Only suboxone...Lol..And ones excuse was cuz u can abuse subutex and it's diverted on the street...Lol..Yea and how many of us know *****s that abuse suboxone strips..For nothing..And sell them on the street....So...Uh yea there goes that theory suboxone makers...It depends on if the person is ready or not..They can abuse subutex or sell it; or suboxone...I myself have left over pills..Always and don't abuse it ...Heh..That is retarded....A waste...Heh....I'm just surprised u went though withdrawal from those weak things...

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PharmDray: You are flat out WRONG. Yes, bupe is a partial opioid agonist. It is also a partial opioid ANTAGONIST. That would be the "blocker" part. And to the other person who said "there's no naloxone in the subutex, so you are good"? Johnny? Yeah, NOPE. The BUPE ITSELF is a partial opioid antagonist. The only reason that Naloxone is in there is to keep addicts from taking it intravenously. Naloxone has a VERY low bioavailability when taken sublingually, therefore you really don't get any effect from taking it under your tongue. Intravenous use is a different story. I have been an opioid addict for 30+ years, have been on Subutex, Suboxone AND methadone, and am involved in medical research. So no, I didn't get my info "from my buddies". I got it from two different M.D's who are addiction specialists (one of whom was the addiction specialist for the Denver Nuggets NBA team) and I got it from my own research. The amount of misinformation on here is STAGGERING. All being presented as if it is from some "world's foremost authority". I only post facts on here; you don't want to believe me? Go ahead and take some Subutex after taking some full agonist opioids. Let me know how that works out for you. I don't give a crap if you ARE a pharmacist (there are plenty of pharmacists, including yourself, who are just plain wrong) but nope, sorry, the naloxone is ONLY in there to keep people from taking it intravenously. Heck, you can look on friggin WIKI and find that out. BUPRENORPHINE ITSELF IS A MIXED PARTIAL AGONIST, PARTIAL ANTAGONIST (BLOCKER) OPIOID RECEPTOR MODULATOR. Meaning, GENIUS, that the ANTAGONIST part is the "blocker" for lack of a more scientific term. Got it, pal? That clear to you? And if you are indeed a pharmacist, maybe you should do a bit more research. Or make a career change. You aren't doing anyone any good dispensing misinformation. And BTW, I know for a fact that you can NOT come up positive for ANY kind of opioids and be involved in the dispensing of pharmaceuticals. So you are full of it anyway. Good job, liar. Good job.

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JOHNNY: Yet again, we have another authority on here dispensing bad advice. I just got through sitting up with someone who with into STRAIGHT UP, HARDCORE PRECIPITATED WITHDRAWALS. Guess what, genius? They took SUBUTEX too soon after full-agonist opioids, NOT SUBOXONE. The Naloxone? Makes NO difference. It is ONLY in Suboxone to keep people from taking it intravenously. This person was SIX DAYS off of methadone and STILL went into a really bad rattle. From SUBUTEX. Geez, I wish you *****s who know NOTHING about the drugs you take would stay the heck off of here.

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I just wanted to add the following excerpt from a reputable source to help clear up any misinformation regarding suboxone/subutex and precipitated withdrawals:

“Precipitated withdrawal can occur when an antagonist (or partial antagonist, such as buprenorphine) is administered to a patient dependent on full agonist opioids. It is a common misconception that the Naloxone in Suboxone initiates precipitated withdrawal.”

Source: naabt.org/faq_answers

Needless to say, Kkh is right and I don’t get the sense that they were ever trying to provide false info. Wikipedia is just one of many outlets of information that verify the truth.

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DAVID: Thank you David. Naloxone is indeed an opioid antagonist ("blocker" for lack of a more scientific description) but Naloxone also has a very low bioavailability when done under the tongue (sublingually) meaning about 10 percent or less of it will even get into your system. Naloxone is given INTRAVENOUSLY to users who are overdosing, which means 100 percent bioavailability. Bioavailability is how much of the drug is used by the body versus how much is wasted. For example, pills taken orally have a much less bioavailability than things administered intravenously, which go directly into the bloodstream. So the bioavailability of intravenous drugs is 100%.

It is THE BUPRENORPHINE ITSELF that throws you into precipitated withdrawals in Subutex/Suboxone, NOT the Naloxone. If I had a nickel for every misinformed "expert" on just this forum who have it wrong, I could have retired long ago. And I don't care if you, Pharma dude, ARE a pharmacist. You won't be the first pharmacist who is misinformed about this drug, and you won't, unfortunately, be the last. Hell, I've come across DOCTORS who have it wrong. As stated earlier, I personally went through it years ago, and just recently watched someone else go through it with SUBUTEX, because they took it too soon after methadone. NO NALOXONE. This person's DOCTOR told them to wait 12 hours after methadone, and also stated that since it was only SUBUTEX, that he would be ok. THIS WAS A LICENSED PHYSICIAN!!! (who BTW, is now under investigation and will most likely have his Schedule II license pulled). So someone coming on here saying "well, I'm a pharmacist, blah blah..." means nothing to me. I'm done. All you "experts" can think what you want. I know the FACTS.

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Your confused Because thats not true! U can take Subutex and percs! Just not suboxone and percs!

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KIMM86: Subutex and Suboxone are the same drug, as the Naloxone in the Suboxone isn't really absorbed by the body when taken sublingually. You are just plain WRONG, and since you are dispensing bad and completely incorrect advice, maybe you should just stay off of here. There is enough bad info on here without you adding to it. Go do some research before spouting nonsense, and you will see how WRONG you actually are. EVERYTHING I wrote is correct, true information. I am involved in medical research and work with the leading addiction specialist in my state. It is YOU who are "confused", not us. You are so confused, it's scary.

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I've been on Subutex for two years but I've had a lot of major dental work. My doctor asked me to stop taking this 24 hours in advance and then I was prescribed 10 mg Percocets. The first time I did it like that and it was fine. The second time I didn't wait the 24 hours and was still perfectly fine. So I don't know why in the world you're going through withdrawals because it doesn't have the naloxone in it. Now if you were talking about Suboxone that would be a different story. I can personally vouch that I was perfectly fine and my doctor told me to do it. I know this post was written in a long time ago but I had to put my two cents in considering I've been in that exact situation. Maybe it's just some peoples bodies are different.

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Are you sure it wasn't suboxone,rather than subutex? I just ask because when I went to rehab four years ago, I popped 3 Vicodin outside of the door before checking in and then they have me 2 subutex within an hour of being there and 2 more at dinner and continued for the next 6 days and I felt great. Thanks

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LOCKE: Subutex and Suboxone are the same drug in as far as what they do to the addict brain when taken as directed. The naloxone is only in there to keep you from taking it intravenously. I just helped someone go through precipitated withdrawals who took Subutex 6 DAYS AFTER taking methadone, and about 19 hours after heroin, and went into precips after having 12 mgs of Subutex. And yes, I'm extremely, absolutely sure they were Subutex. Generic little white 2 and 8 mg pills. So I have no other choice but to call BS on at least some part of your story like maybe the time frame. Now Vics are EXTREMELY short acting, but an hour? I mean, this is chemistry we are talking about here, not opinion, not "everybody's different". Trust me, naloxone bioavailability is less than 10% when taken sublingually. Like 7% or something really low. What's going on here is the Bupe, not the naloxone. UNLESS you administer it intravenously.

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Hello all.. howdy kkh how you been. Im just gonna chime in here again im not a nurse im not a pharmd im not a doctor. I am though a life long addict .not street drugs pharmaceutical addict I am experienced a little and speak from that . The wholr subject is moot here why argue about what we can take with suboxone subutex bupenorphen methadone narcan naltrexone are any other addiction maintenance drug I to take suboxone and , not saying everyone that seeks subutex is seeking to have a safety net and continue using. But I mean come on if you are being prescribed one of the forementioned drugs for addiction then why take any other opiate WHY we are arguing over petty insignificant subjects the number of uneducated people involved in the addiction field is staggering and those who suffer ..well they continue to suffer because doctors out here are prescribing suboxone or subutex or methadone and other opiates I dont understand this also theirs doctors out there ( in my case ) who for many years prescribed ungodly amounts of super strong painkillers like dulaudid or oxycodone or oxycontin how bout we agree that we have a very very flawed system here and many doctors need more education on the effects of the stuff they prescribe ..or lwts say we feed them 8 30 mg roxys a day for say 5 yrs the cut them cold turkey and see how they handle it ...my physical problems turned me a legit chronic pain sufferer into a common street junkie when he decided to follow the rules thank bro ... have a good one guys n see ya kkh glad to see ya still kicking

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JAMES: Hey there, how are you? I hope you are doing well. It does seem like 80% of the questions I answer on here are from people trying to figure out how to "get over" while taking an ORT, how long this drug remains in your system when they are taking a U/A, etc. And hey, I'm an addict, I get it. But it makes me shake my head thinking of all these people trying their damnedest to NOT be clean, while taking drugs INTENDED to help them get clean. I was always of the mind that if I still want to consistently use my drug of choice, I will just skip the ORTs. Why bother? I mean, you are just giving yourself a double habit anyway. No thanks. And these Subutex/Suboxone doctors? They can't just write unlimited amounts of prescriptions for these drugs. They have a certain number of patients they can treat with Bupe. So if someone isn't really serious about recovery, and yet they are taking a slot with a Bupe doctor that someone could have? Yeah, not cool IMO.

But still, MedsChat isn't a "recovery site", it's an informational site, so when someone asks a question that I can answer, I most likely will answer it and not offer any sort of judgement. I agree James, it seems a little counterproductive to me to even be on an ORT while still regularly using, but since I am also an addict, I will not judge. Hope things are going well with you, sir. Let me know if I can answer anything for you!

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Yeeea definitely not BS and I can tell you right now for a fact that is exactly the way the process went and Ive had multiple friends that got ther last dose in before rehab while on the ride over or walking through the door

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Indeed my friend kkh .. im with you , I am doing fine still kicking hope you to as well continue to prosper. Just crazy to see the many questions on here or comments that they are prescribed bupe and an opiate pain killer together asking when or how they should take it . And those of us who understand how they work try to explain the receptors filling the spaces , knocking off the other opiates partial and full antagonist ..ect the answer in layman's terms is DONT TAKE ANY OPIATE AT ALL with ANY bupe based drug you are gambling with a serious side effect or result .. withdrawal. Which is what we all want to avoid kinda simple ... plain simple kinda like taking exlax and washing it down with pepto bismal lol think about it guys you cant dry off with a wet towel good luck all . Kkh you give some of the best most accurate information I've came across on here you are most appreciated here .

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LOCKE: They ONLY way that could work is if we were talking about a REALLY small dose of both. Like I said, this is chemistry we are talking about here. It's a fact.

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JAMES: Thank you. I try to always be accurate, and if I DON'T know an answer, I will find it, or I will stay the hell OUT of it!! Sorry, but I have to call BS on someone saying they took a handful of Vicodins and then took Subs and hour later and was fine, unless it was like MAYBE 4 mgs. of Subs or less, or the Vicodin was expired and ineffective, or SOME variable in there. Nope, doesn't work that way. Like I said, I watched someone go through precips ALMOST 24 HOURS after taking opiates, and SIX DAYS after methadone. Anyway, what can you do? People can post ANYTHING on here. It doesn't necessarily have to be true.

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How do U Know They are not Talking about SUBUTEX!? and Not Suboxone? Because U can Take both pain meds and Subutex! MAYBE People are confusing these 2!

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I took Oxycodone after a surgery and Im on Subutex So I wonder why That dont happen to me...I see a lot of people saying this But Im living proof I didnt go into Precip withdrawl. But I thought I would, and I double and triple checked with the doctor before I took It.

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Sorry Love But Im afraid Your Just straight up WRONG! I took Oxycodone after a surgery and Im on Subutex ..I see a lot of people saying this Crap ur saying and its just that, CRAP! Im living proof I didnt go into Precip withdrawl. But I thought I would, and I double and triple checked with the doctor before I took It. So Ur Researching in the wrong places...

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