Taking Subutex And Percocet Together
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Comments Submitted Says:
 
My doctor just put me on subutex along with percocet. I've been on percocet for yrs for severe and chronic migraines. He told me to take the subutex and if it doesn't work to take a percocet. I usually take 15 mg percocet at a time. I've read some stuff online that worries me. Some people say if you take percs with subutex you'll go into withdrawals. I went through severe withdrawals with fioricet months ago and I don't want to go through that hell again. I took my first subutex about an hour ago and I still have a migraine so I want to take a perc now. Can I do that or will I get sick?

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528
kkh Says:
 
REAL: Then YOU are some sort of modern medical miracle and should be studied by medical researchers, because that is the most incredible story I have EVER heard in all the years I have been an addict, been WORKING with addicts, and been doing research. I doubt it highly. 20 pills a day with only two strips. Right.

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527
Real Says:
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Anyone wanting to quit pain pills. It's real easy if you really want to quit. Find a suboxone strip and cut it into about 12 pieces. Take tiny one before bed and one in morning. Make pieces smaller and smaller. I went from 20 tens a day to nothing with no withdrawal in only 2 full strips

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526
HelpfulFormerFentAddict Says:
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if you take the percocet a while AFTER the sub, it shouldn't send you into wd. But that being said, you probably won't feel the effects of the percocet. If you do feel it, it will be greatly diminished.

Now if you did the other way around, took the percocet first and then the sub, then it could send you into precipitated withdrawal. The bupe in the subutex would literally rip out the percocet molecules from your opioid receptors and replace it with its own. (This is because of its high binding affinity). It wants to bind to that opioid receptor so strongly that it'll displace whatever's currently there.

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525
kkh Says:
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MICHAEL: Starting off on either Subutex OR Suboxone is the same thing. I walked into the doctors office and was given Suboxone the same day with no problems. Neither drug is going to put you into "rapid detox", unless you take them too soon after full-agonist opioids like vicodin or methadone. Then EITHER DRUG will be a problem, because it is the BUPE that can be the problem, NOT the Naloxone. The Naloxone is only in there to keep people from administering the Bupe intravenously, as it is BARELY absorbed when taken under the tongue. Whether the Naloxone is in there or not really doesn't matter unless you are trying to inj. it.

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524
kkh Says:
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SASSYGIRL: Yes, you took a tiny bit of Percocet, and then hours later, you took a tiny bit of Subutex. So it makes sense that you would be fine.

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523
Michael Says:
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So I am confused? Is that why when starting Subutex or Suboxone they recommend you start you off using subutex due to the fact they do not want you to go into rapid detox. Even though it dissolve under the tongue you still have the Naloxone connect with the dopamine receptors. So I'm not quite sure where you're getting your information from but I have research this on many levels and believe wholeheartedly that what I am saying is true. So I will put this out there once again that I have researched on many levels and believe wholeheartedly that what I'm saying is true. So I will put this out there once again when first your coming off of any opiate you will be given subutex at first if you go to the right doctor. Therefore you will not going to rapid drug detox. I had MUSC the medical University of South Carolina I trust with everything I have. When I was pregnant while we make sure I stop 24 hours in advance so that I can get pain relief from labor and delivery. What else do you need to know? Are you on this medication? Are you a doctor? If so where do you work ? I am very close to my prescribing doctor and read him your article on me. He was taken back at how very ill informed you are. Any questions?

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522
SASSYGIRL Says:
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I take about 2 to 3 percocet 10's a day and yesterday afternoon I had to split a percocet in half so they last me and by 9 last night my back was killing me and I took a quarter of a subutex... 0 w/d and it helped my back until this morning!! Now I'm wondering how long after taking the subutex can I take my percocet because my back is starting to hurt again and the rest of that subutex are over at a friends house so I don't take it just because I want too! I am an addict and I have to have my father or boyfriend hold on to my painkillers for me and benzo's or they would be gone in days! But I do have Chronic pain in my back/legs and I have severe anxiety so I need the medication! I just know I cant keep them in my possession, however it truly amazed me how well it works when taking medication right instead of abusing it... Lol I guess they do have a reason for correct dosages!! I DON'T feel high taking them correctly... But I feel great every day and they usually last as long as they should! So for all u addicts out there who do suffer from medical conditions and need medication you can do it! It took me 3 yrs after quitting opiates to finally take my meds right... But I did and I'm so grateful I'm not in pain every day or dealing with anxiety! So good luck campers!!! Just don't over do things and take things the way it suppose too and you'll be fine.

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521
kkh Says:
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DAVID: Thank you!! I am constantly amazed at how many people put drugs into their bodies, when they have no clue how these drugs work! And what's WORSE, these same people turn around and have the NERVE to start dispensing "advice"! Every time I comment on this, I think "Ok, that's it, I'm done.. let them think what they want!" But then I remember the hell that I went through with precipitated withdrawals (from Subutex, NOT Suboxone) and I would hate for someone else to go through it because they listened to some of this mis-information. "Normal" withdrawal is NOTHING compared to precips! So th

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520
James Says:
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Hello all, I see the same ole argument is still raging over taking a buprenorphine based drug with or on top of and after an opiate. Kkh describes it best and is very knowledgeable on the subject. I'm an addict in recovery and I have made this mistake by taking some suboxone too soon, very bad, I mean bad withdrawal. The naloxone in suboxone is to deter iv abuse only it does nothing when taken orally. When taken intravenously it's a craps shoot. Now only way and I repeat the only way you can mix the two / now this is where ya have to really pay attention now.... the only possible way to not get precipitated withdrawal from SUBUTEX. YES SUBUTEX AND OR SUBOXONE (YES SUBOXONE) is to take a very very small dose ORALLY OF SUBUTEX OR SUBOXONE and a VERY VERY SMALL DOSE OF AN OPIATE IN THIS ORDER.... SUBUTEX/SUBOXONE FIRST, THEN A TINY DOSE OF OPIATE. Now again that's a small dose of the bupe based drug first then afterwards a small dose of an opiate. This doesn't even ensure you wont get ill. Now get this, I said either subutex or suboxone ok. Now check this out to the tried and true combination users...lol right... now I will guarantee that if you have opiates in your system and take suboxone or subutex yes I said either you will... yes WILL go into withdrawal.

Now im not trying to sound like a smarty pants or anything, as it's a known scientific fact. I've just seen where an actual quote was posted from the drug information fact site. I suggest ya don't mix a buprenorphine based drug with an opiate period. I also suggest that you examine your logic and thought process if your going to take advice from an individual who suggests you can mix the two substances. Like I said before its the equivalent to taking an anti-diarrhea medication with a laxative. Please take kkh and other's advice on this subject; they are knowledgeable on this subject. Thanks and best of luck to you all.

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519
David Says:
 
KKH is absolutely correct. Buprenorphine (without Naloxone) CAN cause precipitated withdrawal. The proof can be found in the links below. Hopefully the information herein will help put an end to this unneccesary debate:

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2094723

The following excerpt was quoted from The National Alliance of Advocates for Buprenorphine Treatment:

"It is a common misconception that the Naloxone in Suboxone initiates precipitated withdrawal. This is false. The Naloxone can only initiate precipitated withdrawal if IV'ed into a person tolerant to opioids. Taken sublingually the Naloxone has virtually no effect."

Source: naabt.org/faq

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518
kkh Says:
 
JM526: Sure you have bud, sure you have. The one person ON PLANET EARTH that can IV Naloxone after taking opioids and NOT get sick. It's a medical miracle!! I just showed your comment to our staff addiction specialist. We had a good laugh over it. But then addicts would NEVER lie, would they? Stop lying to strangers, it's unattractive.

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517
kkh Says:
 
CigEscorichrollin60s : You freely admit that you have a "high" tolerance, yet you took a TINY amount of both. Do an ACTUAL dose of both, you WILL go into precipitated withdrawal. And as far as the rest of your comment that you know people that "do this all the time"? Yeah, nope. I don't believe you. It doesn't work that way. These are CHEMICAL FACTS. Again, it is the BUPE ITSELF that causes withdrawal, not the Naloxone when taken sublingually. Those are just facts.

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516
Jm526 Says:
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I have had plenty of regular suboxone administered intravenously and didn't get sick.

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515
CigEscorichrollin60s Says:
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I've been on perc 30's for about 3 years..about 3 30's a day..just tonight I took a half of a Subutex and a half of perc 30 together and I have no symptoms of withdrawal..but then again it may just be that I have a really high tolerance. But I've never gotten sick by mixing the 2 and just off the top of my head I know 10 to 12 other folks that mix them as well with no symptoms..hope this helped you.

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514
kkh Says:
 
21CHAPKA: Here we go again. You are wrong. The naloxone in Suboxone does NEXT TO NOTHING unless it is injected. The bioavailability of Naloxone when taken sublingually is less than 10%. So the Naloxone ISN'T the problem.

It is the BUPRENORPHINE ITSELF that "throws you into withdrawal", NOT the Naloxone. Once more (I've only posted this like 50 times) IT IS THE BUPE ITSELF that causes withdrawal. The only reason that Naloxone is in Suboxone is to keep people from administering it intravenously. Holy crap, I am so tired of seeing people who have NO CLUE of what they are putting into their bodies, dispensing bad advice and mis-information on here. "21Chapka"? You are just plain wrong, and I sincerely hope NO ONE takes your bad advice. Sorry to come off harsh, but you clearly don't understand how this drug works. The Bupe itself is throwing you into withdrawal. That's what it is SUPPOSED to do.

So one more time; Suboxone AND Subutex will put you into withdrawals, because it is the BUPRENORPHINE ITSELF that does it, NOT THE NALOXONE. When taken sublingually (under the tongue) Naloxone is BARELY bioavailable, meaning that very little of it will get into your system. It is ONLY in Suboxone to keep people from intravenous use. When you inj. things, they are 100% bioavailable because they are being put DIRECTLY into your bloodstream.

Please people, if you don't know what you are talking about, refrain from dispensing "advice". Thanks.

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513
21chapka Says:
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The naloxone is what throws a person into withdraw. That's why it's subutex and not suboxone. Subutex does not have naloxone.

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512
kkh Says:
 
BETTY: Glad it worked out for you. No, precipitated withdrawal is something you DON'T want to go through. EVER. Glad you are back to "normal"!

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511
kkh Says:
 
ALEC: I'm guessing you HAVEN'T experienced full-blown precipitated withdrawal. You would surely not be saying "uncomfortable for about an hour" if so! "Uncomfortable", I can do. This is a whole other LEVEL of hell. I LITERALLY saw demons.

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510
Betty Says:
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Thank you! I waited a miserable 48 hours and started back on my subutex. I think most of my icky feeling was mild withdrawal symptoms because of the really low dose of pain medicine. It wasn't enough to keep me "normal" much less manage pain. I felt so much better and was able to manage my pain with Aleve after stopping the Percocet and going back onto subs. I appreciate the response!

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509
alec Says:
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The bup knocking off the oxy on your receptors is what makes you feel uncomfortable for bout half our not the low amount of naloxone

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